(no subject)

[sondheimmcgeek]

I just think it's hilarious that all of the Rent fans suddenly consider themselves experts on Broadway shows, when their basic Broadway vocabulary consists of mainstream shows (i.e. POTO, Rent, Wicked, etc.) I mean, if those are the only shows you like, more power to you. But they seem to be taking a "holier than thou" attitude about it all.

Basically, a girl is whining because she hates High School Musical. Why? Because now all of her peers (who don't like "real musicals" like Wicked and Rent) watch High School Musical and reject all other types of musicals that she is trying to shove down their throats.

And it's not just her; it's a hoard of them. They take on this "Well, I know Rent and Wicked so my opinion is law" attitude.

Please.

First of all, it annoys me that they continually refer to the musicals they like as "real musicals." I have yet to see HSM, but as far as I can tell, it is a real musical.

Second, they are acting as though it is supposed to be a ground breaking musical. It was on Disney. I'm sure the target audience was elementary schoolers (not to say some olders ones haven't enjoyed it). That's like me watching Barney and saying "Wow, this is so childish! I mean, the songs aren't good! I wish they'd show real tv shows like Monk and Gilmore Girls!"

While everyone is talking about how they hate people only liking HSM "because it's cool" and how sad it is that they are "not willing to try other musicals" I get this:

"And I think one can get an idea of the quality of a musical based on the awards that they've won. I mean, a musical that completely flopped and wasn't nominated for any Tony's probably wouldn't grasp my interest. However, if I see a musical has won best musical, then of course I'm going to be interested." (in response to me saying the amount of awards a person wins shouldn't be the basis of the show's quality)

Uh, isn't that the same thing as "only liking what's cool" and "not trying other musicals"? You're shutting yourself off to something just because the public didn't like it at the time? Because the Tony voters didn't like it? That's just sad.

Annother of my favorites:

"It's corny, and not the least bit original story line wise. And, what makes things worse is that everyone my age loves it. Then, they go and diss real musicals, like The Phantom of the Opera, RENT, and The Producers."

Yes, because the three "real" musicals have totally original story lines. I mean, come on. One is based on a book, one is based on an opera, and one is based on a movie, so none of them are original as far as the story goes (though I guess since Rent is a modernization of an opera, it's slightly original, but no in the story line, just in its presentation.

Probably the largest of my posts was this (what appears in italics is the person's statement, and my response follows:

Keeping in mind that their targeted demographic is the 7-13ish age range, many of their original series' are contrived and predictable

And you said yourself, their targeted demographic is 7-13ish. You don't need an insanely clever plot ala Sondheim for that age group.

Another thing is that not one of those "kids" is high school aged. I'm totally aware that not many people play their ages these days, but why not use actual high schoolers? The age range of the cast was 19-26, meaning that NONE of them are high school students.

Again, you already answered your own point. Nowadays, people don't always use the correctly aged people for the characters. Look at Reefer Madness: Christian Campbell and Kristin Bell aren't high schoolers, but they played them. In Wicked, Kristin, Idina, and Norbert were all playing characters who were younger than they were. People are always complaining about the age of the actors in Rent, but people always say "Well, in Grease they had older people playing younger people." So why should it be different for HSM? What I've seen of it, they look like they're in high school.

Then of course there was the impossibly inaccurate portrayl of high school. Again, I know that the typical high school activities would not make for a great movie, but I was taking middle school students around our high school on a "preview tour," and they ALL wanted to know why the school wasn't like the one in HSM, why we didn't have EVERYTHING that HSM had. Misleading people so vastly isn't exactly the best idea, is it?

Movies and TV have been doing that for years, and not just through inaccurate portrayls of high school. My high school was nothing like the ones depicted in Saved By the Bell, Beverly Hills 90210, Clueless, Fast Times at Ridgemont High, and 10 Things I Hate About You. I don't think it's the film's fault that people have a hard time distinguishing fiction from reality.

Take Brooklyn, The Goodbye Girl, Dracula, and In My Life as examples. Four fantastic shows that unfortunately didn't fly because they weren't pop-culturey enough for today's society.

...You just used In My Life and Dracula as examples of "fantastic shows"? I think they both didn't fly because they were awful, especially In My Life (which was definitely pop-culturey). Not to mention Brooklyn is about as pop-cultery as it gets.

The sole fact that today's society is more apt to go see a movie than a live show saddens me so greatly that I can't even express it in words.

Well in all fairness, films are more accessable (if you don't live in New York) and they're cheaper, so it makes sense that film audiences would be larger than theater audiences.

All things aside, HSM really was terrible no matter how you look at it.

Matter of opinion.

Look, I haven't seen the film, but I think you guys are making too big a deal out of it. It was meant for children, not make a clean sweep at the Tony awards. You keep whining about how your friends look at it as benig an ultra cool musical, but they ignore the ones you like. A) Don't blame the show for what your peers like and dislike and B) That's their right.

They don't have to like every single musical out there, no matter how much you like it. They can choose on their own. Not to mention, the exmaples of "real musicals" (and no matter how much you dislike it, HSM is by all definitions a "real musical") you guys keep giving are just examples of mainstream musicals. I dislike POTO and I'm not entirely big on Hairspray or Wicked. I don't think disliking those shows make me in any way "wrong." I think it's snotty for you guys to take on a "Holier than thou" attitude about musicals just because (and I think this was the point jman383) was trying to make) you know mainstream shows like Rent, Wicked, POTO, The Producers and Hairspray. You guys are acting as though you're suddenly Broadway experts because you happen to know some of the popular shows (and I know the broadway knowledge of some of you does go beyond that).

There are musicals I (and many people) love, but I know some of you don't. So if I see someone who likes Wicked and hates Assassins, should I take my anger out on Wicked saying "It's an awful show because so-and-so likes that and not Assassins"?

I understand some of you just don't like the show, and that's fine. But you're taking it beyond just "I don't like the show." I mean, I'm sure this isn't the first show you've disliked, but I don't see people rant about any other show they dislike to the extent that they rant about this.

It is a musical meant for children, and, as AmbitiousAardvark said, it does it's job just as well as any Broadway musical does.



Now that I'm done ranting, I must say Kiss Kiss Bang Bang is one of the best films I've seen in a long time. I'm glad Hollywood isn't completely washed up yet.

Edit: Bwahahaha! Now people are saying that POTO and Cats are underrated and that they hated Brokeback Mountain because "it didn't have any significant meaning at all" and had no plot.

Sorry, I just found that hilarious.

Comments

[catthewonderdog.livejournal.com]

I personally don't like HSM. I find it tawdry and shallow. There is no real substance. It just illustrates the same old High School clichés in a "new" way. It's about two people who audition for a show and all their pressures.

The book isn't great. Nothing memorable about it. The songs and the actors weren't really as amazing as everyone else seems to like. I can't find any redeeming qualities to it. Maybe the dancing. Dang. That Kenny Ortega is pretty talented. He should do more movies. I would really love to see him choreograph other stuff. Hehe Newsies.


And don't shoot me, but I don't care much for Brokeback Mountain for various reasons.

[schizophrenic0.livejournal.com]

*attacks*

I kid. I mean, I understand if people don't like HSM, I just don't appreciate the snotty attitude they take as though they know all about Broadway and their poor friends know nothing.

[i-heart-my-geek.livejournal.com]

And this is why I have pretty much abandoned the RENT boards.

Thoough I have been lurkng over at the Sweeney Todd oards...glad to see some of the old RENT boarders on to bigger and better things over there!

My dad said Kiss Kiss Bang Bang was okay, but...not gtreat. I haven't seen it, so I can't say, but I'd certainly plan on listening to your opinion before his.

Do you think POTO and Cats are underrated and Brokeback Mountain are underrated? I'm sorry to say that I don't. I can't stand either POTO or Cats (Phantom has always annoyed the crap out of me, sorry) and I really love Brokeback Mountain.

Oh, and thank you very much for pointing out that awards do NOT make a show. I mean, just look at this year's Tonys. Grrr.

[schizophrenic0.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I post a lot on the Sweeney Todd board.

POTO and Cats are (in my book) hugely overrated and I just don't see why people are comparing BBM and Rent to begin with. I think my biggest annoyance is that the person said it had no significant meaning at all.

PS I don't know if you've checked this week's Rent secrets, but I'm uber-sorry that your name was cut off from my IMDb friends list (because it's in alphabetical order and yours came last). It wasn't intentional! *love*

[i-heart-my-geek.livejournal.com]

Awww, thanks! I totally knew that was yours and I was kind of hoping my name would be on ther ebut hey--it's cool!

I never understood why BBM and Rent were compared. Because they both had gay characters? They're practically opposite stories. But I guess today all films that have "gay relationships" are lumped together. Maybe it should be a new category at the Oscars?

[schizophrenic0.livejournal.com]

Thank you! I mean if there is a gay character in a film it suddenly becomes a "gay film." I love Rent, but it isn't about homosexuality the way BBM is. The focus of BBM is a homosexual relationship. Rent has characters who are homosexual, but it's no more a statement on homosexuality than it is a statement on race (and Rent represents different ones).

I just don't think it's fair to compare them as if they're both a statement on homosexuality, when one isn't, it just has gay characters in it. I mean, Big Daddy had gay characters in it, but I dobut anyone would call it a gay film.